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2016 Postmortem
In reply to the discussion: We Should Only Let Democrats Choose Our Nominee [View all]JustinL
(722 posts)118. when SCOTUS ruled on NY's requirement in 1973, all 3 of the solid liberals agreed that it was absurd
Justices Douglas, Brennan, and Marshall all joined Justice Powell's dissent in Rosario v Rockefeller, 410 U.S. 752. From pp. 768-770 (footnote omitted):
The inquiry thus becomes whether the instant statute, burdening as it does fundamental constitutional rights, can withstand the strict judicial scrutiny called for by our prior cases. The asserted state interest in this case is the prevention of party "raiding," which consists of the movement or "cross-over" by members of one party into another's primary to "defeat a candidate who is adverse to the interests they care to advance." The typical example is a member of one party deliberately entering another's primary to help nominate a weaker candidate, so that his own party's nominee might win more easily in the general election. A State does have an interest in preventing such behavior, lest
Rosario v. Rockefeller, 458 F.2d 649, 652 (CA2). The court below held flatly that the state interest in deterring "raiding" was a "compelling" one. Ibid.
The matter, however, is not so easily resolved. The importance or significance of any such interest cannot be determined in a vacuum, but, rather, in the context of the means advanced by the State to protect it and the constitutionally sensitive activity it operates to impede. The state interest here is hardly substantial enough to sustain the presumption, upon which the statute appears to be based, that most persons who change or declare party affiliation nearer than eight to 11 months to a party primary do so with intent to raid that primary. Any such presumption assumes a willingness to manipulate the system which is not likely to be widespread.
Political parties in this country traditionally have been characterized by a fluidity and overlap of philosophy and membership. And citizens generally declare or alter party affiliation for reasons quite unconnected with any premeditated intention to disrupt or frustrate the plans of a party with which they are not in sympathy. Citizens customarily choose a party and vote in its primary simply because it presents candidates and issues more responsive to their immediate concerns and aspirations. Such candidates or issues often are not apparent eight to 11 months before a primary. That a citizen should be absolutely precluded so far in advance from voting in a party primary in response to a sympathetic candidate, a new or meaningful issue, or changing party philosophies in his State, runs contrary to the fundamental rights of personal choice and expression which voting in this country was designed to serve.
Whatever state interest exists for preventing cross-overs from one party to another is appreciably lessened where, as in the case of petitioners, there has been no previous affiliation with any political party. The danger of voters in sympathy with one party "raiding" another party is insubstantial where the voter has made no prior party commitment at all. Certainly, the danger falls short of the overriding state interest needed to justify denying petitioners, so far in advance, the right to declare an initial party affiliation and vote in the party primary of their choice.
"the efficacy of the party system in the democratic process -- its usefulness in providing a unity of divergent factions in an alliance for power -- would be seriously impaired,"
Rosario v. Rockefeller, 458 F.2d 649, 652 (CA2). The court below held flatly that the state interest in deterring "raiding" was a "compelling" one. Ibid.
The matter, however, is not so easily resolved. The importance or significance of any such interest cannot be determined in a vacuum, but, rather, in the context of the means advanced by the State to protect it and the constitutionally sensitive activity it operates to impede. The state interest here is hardly substantial enough to sustain the presumption, upon which the statute appears to be based, that most persons who change or declare party affiliation nearer than eight to 11 months to a party primary do so with intent to raid that primary. Any such presumption assumes a willingness to manipulate the system which is not likely to be widespread.
Political parties in this country traditionally have been characterized by a fluidity and overlap of philosophy and membership. And citizens generally declare or alter party affiliation for reasons quite unconnected with any premeditated intention to disrupt or frustrate the plans of a party with which they are not in sympathy. Citizens customarily choose a party and vote in its primary simply because it presents candidates and issues more responsive to their immediate concerns and aspirations. Such candidates or issues often are not apparent eight to 11 months before a primary. That a citizen should be absolutely precluded so far in advance from voting in a party primary in response to a sympathetic candidate, a new or meaningful issue, or changing party philosophies in his State, runs contrary to the fundamental rights of personal choice and expression which voting in this country was designed to serve.
Whatever state interest exists for preventing cross-overs from one party to another is appreciably lessened where, as in the case of petitioners, there has been no previous affiliation with any political party. The danger of voters in sympathy with one party "raiding" another party is insubstantial where the voter has made no prior party commitment at all. Certainly, the danger falls short of the overriding state interest needed to justify denying petitioners, so far in advance, the right to declare an initial party affiliation and vote in the party primary of their choice.
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Perez probably feels the same way...Ellison, i'm not sure-he was a Bernie supporter..
asuhornets
Dec 2016
#9
If Sanders could not beat Hillary in the Democratic primaries, why would they think
asuhornets
Dec 2016
#148
I would like the primaries for all parties to be open to all Americans
Zing Zing Zingbah
Dec 2016
#17
You're missing the huge elephant in the room. Clinton, Kerry and Gore had elections stolen . . .
brush
Dec 2016
#104
I disagree..Democrats did not benefit from allowing Independents into the party..Not one bit...nt
asuhornets
Dec 2016
#10
They're voting for a different Party because they don't like the Democratic Party
gklagan
Dec 2016
#157
What about the bad attitudes of millinials and independents who voiced very loudly not voting for...
asuhornets
Dec 2016
#123
when SCOTUS ruled on NY's requirement in 1973, all 3 of the solid liberals agreed that it was absurd
JustinL
Dec 2016
#118
I won't get into the open/closed debate. I'd hope closed primaries are empowered (more delegates)
SaschaHM
Dec 2016
#14
Interesting issue and I can see both sides. I've never liked the opposition meddling in
24601
Dec 2016
#18
On the other hand, if he wasn't allowed to run as Democrat, he could have run as a third party.
LisaL
Dec 2016
#50
The vast majority of "independents" are partisans who just like the term "independent."
Garrett78
Dec 2016
#35
I'd be curious to see who they are asking in their surveys. I think it varies depending on
PatsFan87
Dec 2016
#38
For some, it means Republican. For some, it means Democrat. Very few are swing voters.
Garrett78
Dec 2016
#42
Whatever the reason might be for non-affiliation, the vast majority are partisan.
Garrett78
Dec 2016
#106
I disagree. All candidates campaign to get as many voters from the opposite party to support
napi21
Dec 2016
#25
I would not support the California Democratic Party excluding decline to state registrants.
David__77
Dec 2016
#27
The vast majority of "independents" are partisans who just like the term "independent."
Garrett78
Dec 2016
#29
Joe Manchin likely defines the conservative limit across the Democratic spectrum. But since
24601
Dec 2016
#159
Yes, completely agree. Closed primaries 100%. No open primaries, no undemocratic caucuses.
Maven
Dec 2016
#32
Bernie never said "both parties are the same" and he's not responsible for those who did.
Ken Burch
Dec 2016
#68
My point is how much both turnout and the results differ between primaries and caucuses.
Garrett78
Dec 2016
#95
What do you do in the case of state's where you do not register by party - like VT?
karynnj
Dec 2016
#43
Do you have a link for your allegation about a difference between the parties?
Jim Lane
Dec 2016
#51
They had downballot primary with a non-binding presidential preference poll. Just use that. nt
LLStarks
Dec 2016
#75
But once you vote in a primary, then you are locked into that party for the rest of the cycle
Gothmog
Dec 2016
#109
And the states that don't require party affiliation in their voter registration?
PoindexterOglethorpe
Dec 2016
#83
The vast majority of whom are partisans who just like the term "independent."
Garrett78
Dec 2016
#114
If you don't have the support of the base, you aren't going to win in the general election.
Garrett78
Dec 2016
#117
You notice the way I was talking about the future there, and you keep bringing up Sanders
Kentonio
Dec 2016
#131
The problem is that several states have an open primary by law. Yes we should only let Democrats
totodeinhere
Dec 2016
#125
Even in a state without an open primary, a person can often change party affiliation
Vinca
Dec 2016
#156
I'll say it again, the vast majority of "independents" are strongly partisan.
Garrett78
Dec 2016
#162
I have no problem with that, but lets overhaul the whole damn thing, including the calendar.
Warren DeMontague
Dec 2016
#168
I'd be fine with this if there was some way to allow the 40-some % of Indys
PotatoChip
Dec 2016
#172